Alright Arnold back to the pen we go. Scat finishes their cranks in the US too at their own facility. If he said that about his crank at Speed-o-motive good luck to him because then they will not be our competition for long. Oh one more thing I am done with this thread. I mean it this time not even coming back to view it . Good luck with the hand grenades.

What are you talking about? "be our competition for long"????? How could you know so little about cast cranks and then call someone who has been in this buisness for years to be your competition?

"Done with this thread"  what a joke, your kidding right? What are you afraid of, showing how little you know about cast cranks? BTW you have already done that. ( we both know you, me and everyone else can't stay away,even though we try, lol)

"Good luck with the hand grenades"  Yeah, I'll keep building these hand grenades along with others too. You should build one too.

Now here is some info from: Engines, May15,1994, Over 10 years ago-

pg 20:

"We asked Joe for an example of a thumper street engine, and he showed us this '65 Chevelle, owned by Doug Moore of Hermosa Beach, CA. Under the all-steel front clip is a Sherman built 406 small block with 14.5:1 compression...How much power? Try 652 hourse-power at 7000 rpm and 550 lbs-ft at 5200. The 3300-pound car has 4.56 gears and a meager 10-inch tires, and runs 10.37 at 129 mph. Ooof! Sherman said this motor had the most cranking pressure he's ever seen-260 pounds. With pump gas, he said the cranking pressure limit is about 175 pounds".

Pg 21:

Where Sherman differs from some builders is in his short block. While some insist on an ultra-beefy bottom end using aftermarket blocks, high dollar steel rods, and $1000-plus forged cranks. Sherman say's you don't need them. The money would be much better spent in the heads, where all the power is made..... When it comes to the short-blocks, Sherman says that a stock-block, cast crank, stock rods, and off-the-shelf TRW pistons are good for 600 horse-power, as long as they're quality parts (such as good rod bolts and a straight crank),....Sherman will use a cast crank in a 700-horse engine, but only with aluminum rods and lightweight forged pistons. Sherman claims that alluminum rods will live in a street car, and we've seen examples to back him up.....

Pg 22:

  In summary, if you want to be the fastest, baddest kid on the block, forget about idle quality, pump gas, and torque. Build horsepower and rpm, and gear the wee out of the car.

 This is from the guy who won the 1st Engine Masters. Now I know this sounld like B.S. to you, but until you build one you'll never really know, will you.

I worked for 2 seperate ford dealers, during the 80's and 90's, so believe what you want. You are kidding yourself if you think it will live long with a 300 shot. Anyway, I'm done trying to help you, you obviously won't listen to anyone. See ya later, when you're sweeping up the pieces.

I am no expert, all I know is this motor had cast pistons, 83-85 the power levels on these motors were under 200HP with low comp. (165-175 hp) So lets do the math with a (when you deal with nitrous you will find out that a 300 shot isn't aways a 300 shot, it depends on fuel preasure and bottle temp.)  300 shot+165=@465hp, what is so hard to beleave?

Who said it lived long, all I said was it could be done, look at post 40 I said-

"Yeah, that one ran great, till the fuel pump took a dump and leaned out the motor,resulting in a hole in the piston, but it still ran all the way up to the day we took it apart. lol"

And before that in post 21 I said that I had done it:

Helping me, how, and why?

I'm not the one who ask for help. My motors do just fine with cast cranks in them, I have listed my experiences along with other peoples experinces that I have had dealings with, you list nothing. I have yet to see anything on the net or otherwise that shows that a 450hp motor breaks a cast crank, other than people stating it on this board with no proof of it, and claiming it happens all the time. Yet all you e-thug know-it-all's can't admit when your wrong even when I list companies in the business of selling 500hp+ cast crank motors and I have included some e-mails between me and them. I have spoke to some of them on the phone, and they do not have stock piles of warranty cranks to say there is a high rate of this going on with these companies as so stated. Who is not listening? 

So again, how is it your helping me?

210hp in 85.  

By giving you the correct info, that you screw up.  

"...I have yet to see anything on the net or otherwise that shows that a 450hp motor breaks a cast crank, other than people stating it on this board with no proof of it, and claiming it happens all the time. Yet all you e-thug know-it-all's can't admit when your wrong even when I list companies in the business of selling 500hp+ cast crank motors and I have included some e-mails between me and them..."

I don't believe many folks have disputed cast cranks supporting 500-550hp in a small Chevy.  Heck, it's done often - although on the ragged edge of disaster.  I think you lost credibility when you posted 850hp (on nitrous) with a small cast crank.  The sudden 'jolt' of nitrous (250hp shot in your example - if I recall correctly) is one heck of a 'bang' to the pistons/rods/crank.  Ain't no way a cast small Chevy crank will survive that.  

I agree, and as a side note, I've built some roundy car motors, in the Late Model class, that were in the 550hp range with cast cranks. But as a smart engine builder, I would never build an engine that was going to take that kind of abuse, without using a steel crank. Give Mr. Sherman a call, and ask him. If you have a 400hp motor, and you plan on a 300 shot on top of that, you will want a steel crank, among other things, added to the bottom end, to keep from scattering it.
 

By giving you the correct info, that you screw up.

Again, SHOW ME

Just you opinion that's all

JCharlieM writes:

I don't believe many folks have disputed cast cranks supporting 500-550hp in a small Chevy.

Heck, it's done often -

You smoking crack, read the post, they are trying to say a cast crank breaks with only 450hp, and that it split in two in a tow truck- again B S!!!

JCharlieM writes:

although on the ragged edge of disaster.  I think you lost credibility when you posted 850hp (on nitrous) with a small cast crank.  The sudden 'jolt' of nitrous (250hp shot in your example - if I recall correctly) is one heck of a 'bang' to the pistons/rods/crank.  Ain't no way a cast small Chevy crank will survive that.  

Ever done it? How do you know? So all those shop sell 500hp+ cast crank motors are on the ragged edge of disater? So this guy must be full of it also-

"Now some people will call me crazy, and they have, but i ran a mild 355 motor with 4130rods and srp pistons with a gm cast steel crank, spraying a 2stage 325 total shot on 93 octane. its possible to do, you need a lot of fuel, and not a lot of timing. 11.5:1 A/F ratio and 28-30 degrees of timing. Made 567 to the tires blowing through the stall (SAE corrected, uncorrected was 592). Was a good setup, very fun, I love nitrous, its like liquid crack for your motor."
From the hot rod board-http://forums.hotrod.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=90634&page=0&vc=1#Post90634

I agree, and as a side note, I've built some roundy car motors, in the Late Model class, that were in the 550hp range with cast cranks. But as a smart engine builder, I would never build an engine that was going to take that kind of abuse, without using a steel crank. Give Mr. Sherman a call, and ask him. If you have a 400hp motor, and you plan on a 300 shot on top of that, you will want a steel crank, among other things, added to the bottom end, to keep from scattering it

Oh, now you built 550hp cast crank motors, how interesting????????

I posted what Sherman did, 700hp on a cast crank. But yet a 450hp cast crank would brake in half according to post on this tread. I called SCAT, and they laugh, they have no warranty cranks anywhere that are cranked in half. I call Speedomotive and e-mail them, they have customers using nitrous on cast crank 500hp+ motors. I am in the process of doing a cast crank, stock 400 short rod, TRW piston 383 with at least 250-300 shot of juice. Now let see what I have done, no wait, let see what I am doing as of yesterday- I just worked on a motor I built that is in a 2000lbs car on a single 4 barrel an a plate unit that just ran 7.90 on Sun. with a 1.13 60ft. Now we are going to be at LACR Palmdale Ca. on Weds with a Camaro on nitrous, and should be at Irwindale on Thurs. also with a Camaro. Show me a broken 450hp cast crank, and I'll show you a cast crank flying mofo Camaro on juice, plus a friend of mine with a cast crank 383 Chevelle with a 300 shot should be there also. My be JCharlieM can show up and post his findings.

Have a nice day.  

Have a nice day.

Show me how to have a nice day

Was at the track, and yes I had a nice day ( just my opinion though, others were having a good, I was only having a nice day.)

P.S. 89 post and counting, lol, Who will make it 90th?

That would be me.
You know, I'm not berating you for building a cast crank motor. I'm just telling you, it will last considerably longer, with parts designed for the abuse. I, of all people know you can do it. I choose not to, because my customers and I, prefer longevity over cheap.

So, go get a glass of milk, some Oreos, and chill out for a little while. No ones here to give you ####, for doing it on the cheap, thats one of the perks to hot rodding, do it your way. It only has to make you feel good. When that motor pukes, build another one, your way.

Understand, I've been wrenching professionally for 22 years, and building engines for 15, I've learned alot, and prefer not to shortcut anything detrimental to the engines surviveability. That, and I lean toward overbuilding my engines.

FLY WITH JUNK RACING'S
1977 NOVA PAGE


Here is a little narrative on the Nova.  It was written by the car
owner,driver,builder,master mind... (you get the idea) Andrew
Nelson.


"Intake is box stock Vic Jr. with no porting. 850 Holley on top.
Headers are 1 7/8" x 32" with a home fabricated collector. Two 3"
secondary pipes to a SINGLE 4" exhaust. Muffler fabbed from 5" tractor
trailer stack found on road.

Weight reduction was 1,162#. As raced weight 2,727# (with me, helmet & gas). No I
don't
weigh 500#, I tip scales at 219 1/2 with helmet.  Remember it is a four door.

The Canfield heads have a shifted intake port and NO port work done. The Intake
port is
195 cc and flow 259" at 28".

Unknown converter that stalls about 2,800 on line with foot brake. The thing sounds
like it's
turning a bazzillion rpm's because of the single exhaust. Shift 1-2 at 6,700 and 2-3 at
6,900.
Through traps at 6,800 with 4.11 gear & 28.5" tire. 92 octane at Challenge because of
temp. 10.48 on posted time slip was 87 octane. NO NOS. "

http://sanyarcomotorsports.com/flyswithjunk.html

That would be me.
You know, I'm not berating you for building a cast crank motor. I'm just telling you, it will last considerably longer, with parts designed for the abuse. I, of all people know you can do it. I choose not to, because my customers and I, prefer longevity over cheap.

So, go get a glass of milk, some Oreos, and chill out for a little while. No ones here to give you ####, for doing it on the cheap, thats one of the perks to hot rodding, do it your way. It only has to make you feel good. When that motor pukes, build another one, your way.

Understand, I've been wrenching professionally for 22 years, and building engines for 15, I've learned alot, and prefer not to shortcut anything detrimental to the engines surviveability. That, and I lean toward overbuilding my engines.

Just got done with my milk, saved the best unbelievable for last;

I know you did not say it, but I am not arguing about whether going with good parts will last longer, all I'm saying is that cast cranks do not snap in half from 450 HP motors. I am also saying junk can go fast, never said it would last long, but did say it does not break in half right from the get go. When a crank cracks, it does not break in half, it just gets a crack in it. I have run cracked steel cranks in junk motors for over 2 years with out failure. Eventually they will snap, but after the crack has travelled threw the crank, and that could take years. One big block motor I ran a cracked Valasco 4.25 stroke crank for 5 years of street driving, with occational strip use, no nitrous, running in the 10's with a 3500lbs Chevelle without it ever breaking in half, eventually replacing it when I sold the motor. I still have the crank, and the crack has not gotton bigger, but it is still junk and I will run it again. I don't sell these motors, just run them myself, and am not the only one who does it, just one who is admitting to doing it. Yeah it's dangerous, so is street racing, but if I keep checking the cracks during servicing of the motor, you can stay a head of the game before it fails completely.

I am building a 383 with a cracked block filled with hard block, cracked cast crank, and cheezy heads. Curious as to how long this will last in a cheap race car for a friend of mine who can't afford to go racing, but still wants too to go racing. I am giving him this real gernade motor at no charge. 

Most of the time the piston fails first before the crank ever does. One 383 lost a piston and put a hole in the block, and bent the rod into a horse shoe shape and stopped the cast crank cold, the crank was checked for straightness and for cracks, and it was fine, and if were not for the scars on the counter wieghts, you would never had know it was in an engine explosion. But then I had a freashly ground Chevy cast crank that had laid on it side for 18 months, and it had a 1/2 a thousands bend in it, and I had to get it re ground again. So a crank can stand getting hammered but can't stand something as simple as being on it's side,lol, live and learn.