"Muscle" means different things to different people.  To some, its a first gen Camaro, idleing away with a lumpy cam, ready to pounce.  To others, muscle is a Dodge SRT-4, jumping off the line and spanking a "tuner" civic.  To me, if its domestic, its usualy good.  My first car was a 1984 Monte Carlo SC, with the anemic 305 and 350 tranny.  It was what showed me the light, the line between an awesome car, and the crap all the other kids my age were driving. Im only 19, yet ive been lucky to go through 2 Monte Carlos, 1 1992 Corvette, and a 1996 Firebird.  But that dosent make me ignorant to the fact that there are kids out there my age, that have Civics that can smoke my ass...but any rich dumb ass who dosent know how to spend his money can go buy a civic just like the rest of the import sheep.  They can dump all their money into that econobox if that what makes them happy, but no neon lights, no sheetmetal wing, and no sorry movie can change the way i feel every time I see one of the many bad ass vehicles roaming the streets of our country. Muscle is not a V8. Muscle is that kid who is sitting in his turbo V6 Buick GN. Muscle is that guy who just finshed putting in the big block in his 69 Chevelle. Muscle is the proud owner of the new import killing 2.4 liter turbo SRT4. Muscle is the youth of America, who dont believe all  the best cars are the ones coming out of the land of the rising sun...

I"m going to have to disagree with you on calling a srt-4 a muscle car.  It's a rice-burner just like all of the other small motor cars around.  I would have no more respect for a srt-4 than a mitzubeatme eclipse.  Muscle cars are big cars with powerful motors, you need more than just a domestic nameplate to call it muscle.  I"m not trying to start a fight, just sharing my opinion.  However, it is good to see i'm not the only teen who likes american cars.  

No man, I totaly understand you, and I understand the fustration coming from the muscle car youth of america, were the new generation of muscle car lovers, but we live in a time where big v8s arent the dominating force in the showroom, and on top of that, we are forced to hold our own with ignorent ricers who get their attention in cheap ways like neon lights and wings and whatnot.  But this is where you dont understand: I was just like you. I love muscle cars so much and seeing these ignorent Honda owning sheep, it was easy to confuse the real people who build fast 4 cylinders, from sticker cladded neon sporting, mean mugging, pansy ricers.  But slowly I realized, Im only kidding myself if i believe all 4 banger performance cars are "rice", and slow.  The truth is my friend, not all of them are.  Fact is, whether I want to believe it or not, that little 2.4 liter in that SRT-4 CAN DO ALMOST WHAT MY 1992 CORVETTE CAN!  And that is amzing, my friend, for $20,000, that little car, that little AMERICAN car, can spank import ass, and even some v8s.  Granted, I could build the LT1 in my vette to waste that car, and the Subaru WRX, but the thing is, those cars do that STOCK.  And you know what? We should be proud Dodge and Ford are kicking ass at the imports own 4 cylinder game, because they truely are muscle cars, they are wolves in sheep clothing.  We cant be ignorent to the fact that 4cylinders can keep up with some of the best "muscle cars". A "ricer" will refuse to buy the Ford Focus or SRT 4 because it is an "american car, and american cars suck".  You see, they are the dumb asses who cant admit that we can keep up with the asians at their own game, without "big gas guzzling v8s".  They are the enemy, my friend. So next time you pull up next to a (non riced out) Srt 4, Focus, or Saturn Redline, know that hes fighting the same battle as you: KICKING HONDA  AND IMPORT ASS! 

I am really supprised to see anyone refer to anything newer than a '71 model as a muscle car.  These cars do not have the styling that the old muscle cars had no matter how much junk you bolt on.  I will give it to them that they will perform but that is not all a muscle car is.  It is still a generic economy car, period!  

like i said, "muscle" means somthing different to everybody.  I love muscle cars as much as the next guy, and usualy when someone says "muscle cars", a Hemi Cuda or a 69 Camaro come to mind.  I agree, no car can have the same styling as these cars, but alot have the same "soul": Go fast, look good, no bullsh**t.  And lots of cars after 71 had this.  1987 Buick Grand National, 1983-88 Monte Carlo SS, 2002 Camaro SS...ect ect.... these cars may not have the same big blocks and four barrels their big block cousins had in the 60s and 70s, but they are every bit as much of a "muscle car" as them .  You guys wanna check somthing out?: Go to the HONDATUNING message board, these ricers need to be schooled, they talk mad shi t, and are haters.  Do me a favor, and read the post, " H old O n N ot D one A ccelerating" over there at that message board, read the whole thing, and post what you think over there, we need to show these guys what the deal is. 

"muscle" means somthing different to everybody. 

My 2 cents worth;

From:

Perhaps the most common question people have is what exactly is a muscle car. The term wasn't even used until the late 1970s, in the 1960s there were often called "Super Cars" if called anything at all. Therefore, the actual definition of a muscle car, or which models were muscle cars, is a topic that is often disputed. Here is the general interpretation of what is a muscle car and what cars qualify, and which don't.

A muscle car, by the strictest definition, is an intermediate sized, performance oriented model, powered by a large V8 engine, at an affordable price. Most of these models were based on "regular" production vehicles. These vehicles are generally not considered muscle cars, even when equipped with large V8s. If there was a high performance version available, it gets the credit, and not the vehicle that it was based on.

Examples: Buick GS, Chevrolete Chevelle SS, Dodge Charger R/T, Ford Torino/Cobra, Plymouth GTX, Plymouth Road Runner, Oldsmobile 442, Pontiac GTO

The strict definition only includes intermediate size vehicles. In reality, performance oriented intermediate size vehicles didn't appear until 1964. Before then, manufacturers took existing fullsize vehicles and added extra performance to them. Because of this, the early fullsize performance vehicles are generally considered muscle cars.

Examples: Chevrolet Impala (SS only), Ford Galaxie (with 390 + cid engines only), Dodge Coronet (R/Ts only), etc.

In addition to fullsize and intermediate muscle cars, a number of smaller vehicles started appearing on the automotive performance scene. These new "pony cars" and compact cars are generally considered muscle cars only if they have the top of the line performance engines and options.

Examples: Chevrolet Camaro (SS and Z28 models only), Ford Mustang (GTs and Boss only), Plymouth 'Cudas (no Barracudas), AMC Javelin, etc.

Although there were several personal luxury vehicles with performance engines and options, their heavy weight and high sticker prices went against the low cost performance definition of muscle cars. Therefore, they are not considered muscle cars.

Examples: Buick Riviera, Chrysler 300 Letter Cars, Pontiac Grand Prix, etc.

Two seat sports cars such as the Chevrolet Corvette and the Ford Thunderbird are not considered muscle cars due to their high price and specialty nature. The only exception is the AMC AMX as it was relatively cheap, and was based on the AMC Javalin pony car.

Examples: AMC AMX, etc.

I quit reading this when I got to the second car. 

Big Block AMC, need I say more.

I don't know if i agree with their definitions either.  Only SS chevelles are muscle cars?  Only R/T chargers?  Seems like a lot of us Detroit Muscle guys don't even own muscle according to them.  I guess personally I'll call a 74 charger a muscle car just as much as a 69, just like i call a 67 camaro muscle like i would call a 70-81 muscle.  Granted the newer ones were lacking in the power department, but the concept is still there.  I dunno i guess i'm a little biased, being that i own smogged-up muscle, but it's really up to everybody's interpretation. 

BTW- I fixed the "smog problem" lol.  

I'm well aware that this thread is quite old, however... I own a '73 Javelin/AMX. Its a muscle car even with its mild 304 V8. AMC never made a big block by the way. The 401 was a small block. My definition of a muscle car is: A realitivly lightweight (compared to horsepower) car, usually american, almost awlays rear-wheel drive. Muscle cars come with either V8's or on the rare occasion in more recent times V6's.

My basic list of "factory" muscle cars are as follows: (all have V8's unless otherwise metioned)

AMC Javelin
AMC AMX
AMC Rebel/Rouge
AMC Matatdor (fastback version)
Chevy Camaro
Chevy Bel Air (two-door)
Chevy Chevelle ('till about '74ish)
Dodge Charger (untill about 1975)
Dodge Challenger (excluding the version in the 80's)
Dodge Demon (not the concept car)
Dodge Dart (2-door)('till '74)
Plymouth Duster
Plymouth Barracuda and 'Cuda
Olds Cutlass ('till '88)
Chevy Monte Carlo (except '88-2005 unless SS version)
Buick Grand National (only car here with a V6 thats a muscle car)
Buick Regal T-Type (see Grand National)
Plymouth Roadrunner/ GTX
Chevy Nova (excluding the 80's front drive version)
Ford Mustang (excluding the Mustang II)
Mercury Cougar (except for 74ish-86ish and last version, the retro-looking one)
Ford Torino
Ford Fairlane (2-door)
    "Sister" cars ( i.e.: Nova/omega/appollo) are excluded (as much as possible)for space purposes from the list.
-

As far as "muscle" trucks:
Dodge "The Dude" (Look it up)
Dodge Little Red Express
Ford F-150 Lightning
Chevy Silverado SS454
Dodge Ram SRT-10

The Corvette and Viper are super cars (same class as Lambos and Porsches), not muscle cars. They keep in tune with muscle car idealology with light car/big motor/ horsepower, however they are way out and beyond in new car pricing for the average joe to buy (The reason most people gave when they stopped buying F-Bodies= too expensive compared to the Mustang).

On a side note: If you buy an average car not considered to be a "muscle" car from the factory and build it up (i.e.: motor swap, headers ect.) it then could be considered a muscle car.

Cars such as Dodge Neons (SRT-8 or not), Ford Focus, Lancers, WRX's, Civic's ect.. are not and will never be "muscle" cars, no matter how fast they are.

Just my dime + 2 cents worth of opinion. Oh and I'm 23 and have own my AMX since I was 18.


1973 AMC Javelin/AMX, 1986 Ford F-250, 1999 Ford Ranger.  

a musclecar has to have muscle. cars haven't had muscular features since before '80. another thing a musclecar needs is a strong sounding v8. something lumpy(ish) and mean (when the pedal hits the metal). fact of life.  

reok999:
I'm well aware that this thread is quite old, however... I own a '73 Javelin/AMX. Its a muscle car even with its mild 304 V8. AMC never made a big block by the way. The 401 was a small block. My definition of a muscle car is: A realitivly lightweight (compared to horsepower) car, usually american, almost awlays rear-wheel drive. Muscle cars come with either V8's or on the rare occasion in more recent times V6's.

My basic list of "factory" muscle cars are as follows: (all have V8's unless otherwise metioned)

AMC Javelin
AMC AMX
AMC Rebel/Rouge
AMC Matatdor (fastback version)
Chevy Camaro
Chevy Bel Air (two-door)
Chevy Chevelle ('till about '74ish)
Dodge Charger (untill about 1975)
Dodge Challenger (excluding the version in the 80's)
Dodge Demon (not the concept car)
Dodge Dart (2-door)('till '74)
Plymouth Duster
Plymouth Barracuda and 'Cuda
Olds Cutlass ('till '88)
Chevy Monte Carlo (except '88-2005 unless SS version)
Buick Grand National (only car here with a V6 thats a muscle car)
Buick Regal T-Type (see Grand National)
Plymouth Roadrunner/ GTX
Chevy Nova (excluding the 80's front drive version)
Ford Mustang (excluding the Mustang II)
Mercury Cougar (except for 74ish-86ish and last version, the retro-looking one)
Ford Torino
Ford Fairlane (2-door)
    "Sister" cars ( i.e.: Nova/omega/appollo) are excluded (as much as possible)for space purposes from the list.
-

As far as "muscle" trucks:
Dodge "The Dude" (Look it up)
Dodge Little Red Express
Ford F-150 Lightning
Chevy Silverado SS454
Dodge Ram SRT-10

The Corvette and Viper are super cars (same class as Lambos and Porsches), not muscle cars. They keep in tune with muscle car idealology with light car/big motor/ horsepower, however they are way out and beyond in new car pricing for the average joe to buy (The reason most people gave when they stopped buying F-Bodies= too expensive compared to the Mustang).

On a side note: If you buy an average car not considered to be a "muscle" car from the factory and build it up (i.e.: motor swap, headers ect.) it then could be considered a muscle car.

Cars such as Dodge Neons (SRT-8 or not), Ford Focus, Lancers, WRX's, Civic's ect.. are not and will never be "muscle" cars, no matter how fast they are.

Just my dime + 2 cents worth of opinion. Oh and I'm 23 and have own my AMX since I was 18.


1973 AMC Javelin/AMX, 1986 Ford F-250, 1999 Ford Ranger.

This thread is incredibly old...and honestly pointless...anyone on this forum will have a muscle car...

That being said, you left out the most obvious muscle car of all time...  

Mr.WFO:
a musclecar has to have muscle. cars haven't had muscular features since before '80. another thing a musclecar needs is a strong sounding v8. something lumpy(ish) and mean (when the pedal hits the metal). fact of life.

Have you ever looked straight at the front end of a '98+ Pontiac Trans Am with the Ram Air hood?  If that isn't a muscular looking car then my judgement is way off.  

It was 3AM EST, so forgive me. I did forget to mention the Pontiac Tempest La Mans GTO.  

Everyone has their own definition of musclecars, but it is just your opinion. Somebody may consider an 80s Caprice muscle, it's just their outlook on things. I don't think there are any year restrictions on what can or cannot be considered a musclecar. Even engine size doesn't necessarily dictate whether or not something is a musclecar. In the mid to late 70s nothing really made what could be called astronomical power, not even big-blocks, yet those cars can still be considered musclecars. Also, the newer F-bodys are definitely muscle, so that also proves that age has no meaning. This is my opinion, not fact or anything like that.  

it's got an aggressive nose, but the child-bearing hips and plastic leave it wanting.