This is a generalised question which requires a well informed electrician/someone who customises circiuts and is'nt afraid of answering a hypothetical question,also to inform me of a "ball park" figure of what the components would cost to do the job reliably and the possible maintenance required if successful(tips,etc)and NO I DONT WANT A CONVENTIONAL EFI multi parameter computer!!             ... I want to control the injectors via dizzy! I want to bridge or merge a seperate wire for each spark plug lead in this case its a 6cyl,so 6.Then by clever use of the firing order i.e 153624 ...the  wire off no5 lead will go to injector 1,  no3 to inj5 ,no6 to inj3 etc essentially sequential efi.              ...As I understand it, I must know exactly the pulse or voltage of coming from the dist. cap is it really 40 or 50 thousand volts? and in the millisecond that pulse goes to the sparkplug would it operate the solenoid of a single fuel injector? I think it would fry the injector .    ....Accel has varieties of injectors ranging from 4 to 14 ohms.they dont tell you the operating voltage?I guess its 12v.but it could be less.I'm assuming I would require 6 of each as it would be 1 component per wire.I think on each wire(for injectors)would be a resistance device and or voltage regulator.Is this correct?and if so exactly what components,where I could obtain them and how much cost.        ...The cheaper the better,the smaller components(size) also better in this scenario OR custom injectors that have 40,000v plus solenoid rating.By the way carby becomes mech. throttle body and inj. delivery is by adjustable fuel pressure....... (how ,sorry thats my secret! but it works and mechanically fully adjustable) you get total cc's per minute, multiplied by number of injectors and a cfm of compatable rating at the carb`.Sounds complex ,but someone in the CARCRAFT world should satisfy my subborn curiosity...........PLEASE!  

Im not going to say that it cant be done,but its just not worth the trouble.
If you dont want a computer,I would suggest that you look into a full
mechanical fuel injection.
In the end,a Megasquirt would probaly be your best option. Good luck.  

thanks juicedcoup for at least replying.                  ... I still require the answer I seek regardless of its craziness or absurdity of the idea I'm a tech and info junkie,love physics,chemistry and metalurgy the more I learn comprehensively the less trial and error I have to endure. .........                   One theory which I'd like to avoid is going crank trigger with individual coils per cyl and power the distributor with 12v and appopriate voltage reg for the injectors.EFI comps are great for perfect economy,however they are way overcredited for what they actually do and restricted in some situations and a comprensive cost of 5 to 6 grand complete,I could bust that by a third of the price,get better performance range(forced induction)and this project may see driving duties 12 times per year,so cost simplicity and a calculated approach is my theme.My list so far,............ all labour,machining and fabricating FREE( as I'm an industrial fitter/machinist/welder/fabricator) steel/copper tubing and all fittings are cheap if you know how and where to get, Not a speed shop!then 6 x 60lbs injectors cost $700.00, 1 x 600 hp 70psi high flow fuel pump $700.00,2 x inline 10 micron filters $250.00, 2 x mechanical regulators $50.00 (rated to 200 psi),1 x MSD digital or multi step retard between 4 to $550.00 and 2 x fuel pressure gauges(cheap) maybe $100.00 for both and $100.00 for lines ,solder and fittings.So for under $2,500 I can achieve what costs the average 'joe'$6,000!.........................................why injetion? because with 92 or 98(we have in oz) at high pressure mist can handle 12:1 compression!! carbs cant do that on pump gas!Don't believe me check out engine specs on 2007 suzuki hyabusa 198hp from 1360cc or 1.3 litre engine naturally aspirated with knock sensors and timing control.This is why they EFI works well with blow through forced induction.................................Some new EFI's have between 700 to 900psi at the needle point of injection, its been proven the more atomization achieved the more comp u can run! With carbs you vastly restrict air flow to achieve this i.e it'd be like using a 350cfm holley on a motor that requires 1,050cfm to achieve its desired power.A common practice is to use a 650dp base plate with 850 cfm body,this is with race grade fuel not pump unleaded..........................................By the way lead bromide is the lead they used in the 70's it did alot towards protecting valves and cyl bores on cast iron blocks as well as reduce detonation.But causes pollution. .......................Some big blocks had 12:1 comp and solid cams in the late 60's and 70's they ran fine except for very hot days with carbs! all day streeters.....................................So back to 2007,tech is getting back to the good ol' days with high comp pump gas streeters.static raised compression is almst free power for a given consumption of fuel.Look out as LPG(propane) has power attributes better than nitrous and racing fuel.THe catch?...................................... raw 900kpa direct bottle pressure feed only works with mega compression like 16:1 or high boost like 28psi or greater with a static of 8.5:1. RPM switch and solenoid oxy/acetelene non return flame arresting valve. MUST only be used under hard acceleration i.e Flat out coming on between 2,500 and 3,000 rpm.Works inconjunction with twin high flow regular propane convertors with 118 octane rating............................Benifits,readily available,burns cleaner,very inexpensive fuel with better economy than petrol and nitrous and racing fuels. Raw injection SUPER COLD,perfect for hot engine situations,radically condenses converted propane , cools boosted air temp instantly, pistons ,heads and manifolds,cyl bores = maga hp potential! how good?.............................. How does 800hp from a 3ltr inline nissan 6cyl thats only 3000cc from a single turbo and street cam.14psi boost for street using twin converters ,with the raw delivery only used on 28 psi runs 1/4 mile.10.7 sec on street tyres spinning the entire track!in a gm wagon from late 80's(stock) the 6 is a nissan rb30. With slicks and race set up 8sec passes would be totally credible...........................2 x oxy multi holed cutting nozzels fitted to the inlet manifold for the raw line which is on or off at 2,500. Why not all the time? raw propane expands at an incredible rate, deadly at idle speeds!!! under load/boost (very high comp) it works fine.You need 2 tanks.1 for the twin coverters the other for the direct line, oh greatly reduces engine preignition  to zero and allows more timing advance.Have a chew on that. Highly illegal!! to do ,but works and exxxtremely well, its a quiet engine as well...........................................The raw propane is better than an intercooler could ever hope to be!look at a forklift propane bottle on a cold morning you'll see a thin layer of ice near the valve on the neck of the bottle!you will require stainless valves and stellite valve seats,forged crank,rods,pistons and full crank girdle to push these limits! Happy trails!  

K...first of all how bout some paragraphs...thats incredibly difficult to read.  Second...this seems like a heck of a lot of work for nothing.  

But as for using the distributor to fire the injectors...how are you going to control and change the pulse width?  How are you going to control and change the pulse duration?  Sequential fuel injection controls each injector individually...and it a heck of a lot more accurate than running it off of your spark plug wires.  You want that injector firing really before the valve opens to ensure the correct fuel mixture...last thing you want is for the valve to be on its way back up when your injector fires...that'll create one heck of a lean mixture.  

Its your project...but I fail to see any benefit.  You probably won't find the help you need here.  Not only is this board considerably slower than it used to be...but we typically don't design complete EFI systems from scratch.  

CSIROC:
K...first of all how bout some paragraphs...thats incredibly difficult to read.  Second...this seems like a heck of a lot of work for nothing.  

But as for using the distributor to fire the injectors...how are you going to control and change the pulse width?  How are you going to control and change the pulse duration?  Sequential fuel injection controls each injector individually...and it a heck of a lot more accurate than running it off of your spark plug wires.  You want that injector firing really before the valve opens to ensure the correct fuel mixture...last thing you want is for the valve to be on its way back up when your injector fires...that'll create one heck of a lean mixture.  

Its your project...but I fail to see any benefit.  You probably won't find the help you need here.  Not only is this board considerably slower than it used to be...but we typically don't design complete EFI systems from scratch.

I agree with all this, all of it.  

Apologies for no paragraphs! Um, ok an injctor is activated by a solenoid.Its activated by a given charge. Other then that injector doesnt know how much pressure is behind it. basically it opens and closes. the longer the charge is applied the longer it stays open.The only way manufacturers know its flow rating is by flow test at 43.7psi.       Therefore the flow rating is predetermined for a given power rating. You cant just put any size injector and hope that the computer will make it all ok.              EFi has an idle circuit and the rest of the time its relying on ignition pulse to determine engine speed RPM, to know how many times per minute to pulse(activate) the injectors in a given sequence. Pulse width is an idea for perfect eonomy and power.           My point is how long can even at 1000rpm  is a millisecond(same as a distributor pulse) going to change things NOT MUCH!                   Carbies work full time only at less pressure with bigger volume jet sizes,than an injector.   At 7000rpm the pulse rate is insanely fast, so the injector manufacturers KNow that pulse width will only do so much. they dont rely on pulse width!! they rely on nominal flow rating and fuel pressure regulation. Usually with a high and low pressure fuel pump,in conjunction with the pulse coming from the distributor.              I'm not after perfect economy. O2 sensors are really pollution control devices, which they justify by telling you its require for tuning.(yes maybe) What happens happens when the o2 sensor fails clogged with carbon,but sending a false reading then the computer works off a false information.     I know its tedios but read my method carefully ,it could work on any engine with slightly less accuracy and No, the point of injection would be accurate . Remember 1 injector per runner . a firing order of 153624 would see the spark on 5 actuate the injector for 1 and follows that pattern .            So providing there is no electrical failure ,it wont be 100% ACCURATE   but I'd  be gunning for 85 to 90% with far more versatility.  

its a fixed pulse width. the more engine speed the more fuel pressure you give it to a point. As a side point EFI injectors open and close so many times per cycle ,lets say 1000 times per minute for each injector @ 1000rpm.At 7000rpm each injector is opening 7000 times per minute= more or less fuel at whatever rpm,the same speed the rotor is moving in the dizzy............With two regulators one just after the pump controling main line pressure to 45 psi(it can be raised to 60 or 70 psi from your dash) the other is linked to the carb throttle lever mechanically set via a stop to say 6psi for idle...............as you accelerate the fuel pressure rises till say 3000 rpm when you reach  43.7psi then injector rating comes into play........................sooo you select a set of injectors that can do the job and overrate them by 5 or 10% of the numbers HP that your engine will make.  

Why don't you stop throwing tons of useless information our way and go fail at creating your homemade injection system and get it over with. If you know more about this than we do (which by your posts you obviously think you do) then don't listen to us. Shut up and go build the thing...  

powerdreams:
Apologies for no paragraphs! Um, ok an injctor is activated by a solenoid.Its activated by a given charge. Other then that injector doesnt know how much pressure is behind it. basically it opens and closes. the longer the charge is applied the longer it stays open.The only way manufacturers know its flow rating is by flow test at 43.7psi.       Therefore the flow rating is predetermined for a given power rating. You cant just put any size injector and hope that the computer will make it all ok.              EFi has an idle circuit and the rest of the time its relying on ignition pulse to determine engine speed RPM, to know how many times per minute to pulse(activate) the injectors in a given sequence. Pulse width is an idea for perfect eonomy and power.           My point is how long can even at 1000rpm  is a millisecond(same as a distributor pulse) going to change things NOT MUCH!                   Carbies work full time only at less pressure with bigger volume jet sizes,than an injector.   At 7000rpm the pulse rate is insanely fast, so the injector manufacturers KNow that pulse width will only do so much. they dont rely on pulse width!! they rely on nominal flow rating and fuel pressure regulation. Usually with a high and low pressure fuel pump,in conjunction with the pulse coming from the distributor.              I'm not after perfect economy. O2 sensors are really pollution control devices, which they justify by telling you its require for tuning.(yes maybe) What happens happens when the o2 sensor fails clogged with carbon,but sending a false reading then the computer works off a false information.     I know its tedios but read my method carefully ,it could work on any engine with slightly less accuracy and No, the point of injection would be accurate . Remember 1 injector per runner . a firing order of 153624 would see the spark on 5 actuate the injector for 1 and follows that pattern .            So providing there is no electrical failure ,it wont be 100% ACCURATE   but I'd  be gunning for 85 to 90% with far more versatility.

O2 sensors have absolutely nothing to do with emissions.  It is not an emission control device.  EFI is an open loop system while the engine is cold...O2 sensors do not work until the operating temperature is high enough for them to measure the oxygen content in your exhaust.  During this period...the computer is reacting to a set group of injector pulse widths and timing curves (among other things) based on the MAF/MAP and TPS sensors.  As soon as the operating temperature is high enough, it becomes a closed loop system.  At this point, the computer is reading a voltage from the O2 sensor that corresponds to a set oxygen content in the exhuast.  The computer changes the fuel mixture using this reading and the readings of other sensors (like the MAF/MAP and TPS) to obtain a perfect air-fuel ratio for a given load.  Air-fuel requirements are different under part throttle at 3000 RPM compared with WOT at 3000 RPM.  The sensors work in conjunction with each other to obtain a perfect AF ratio.

Pulse widths change...they have to be tuned.  This is how the computer adjusts fuel mixture.  And just because the change in pulse widths may be on a very small time scale...does NOT mean that they can be ignored.  It simply means that the margin for error is MUCH smaller.  The pulse width must be EXACT.  Fuel pressure never really changes...at least not with an electric pump.

What you are doing is highly inaccurate.  If I had to bet...I'd say its going to fail.  And like Gibs said...if you don't care to listen to anything we are saying...then just go build the thing.  I have a degree in mechanical engineering...AND have been dealing with EFI systems for longer than I've cared to.  Trust me when I say these are legit concerns when building your own EFI system.  Your thinking that an O2 sensor is an emissions control device worries me even more about this contraption...showing you really don't understand the workings of EFI quite as well as you think you do.  You might want to read up on this stuff a bit more before diving in.

Good luck.  

Thankyou to the people who replied.Seriously forgive me for having an idea and your insults and unkind words do nothing but amplify ignorance......................... I have NEVER stated that I'm an EFI expert.I am hypothesising via some basic principles.To comprehend my theory? you have to think outside the square!                   .............. I AM NOT disagreeing with anyones advice! So what would all of you say to the PERSON who tries to achieve anything by uncoventional means................................... Anyone who thinks its useless information .SIMPLY DONT REPLY.............................. If or when I decide to undertake the system,it will be at my disretion,not anyone elses. And to burst the bubble, GM on an 80's 6cyl engine had injectors controlled by a distributor module!! with spark duties via crank trigger FACTORY!production car................................ I was hoping someone could satisfy my original question, without the sarcasm and innuendos.I RESPECT THE WEALTH OF KNOWLEDGE THAT PEOPLE POSSES REGARDING EFI. ..............I still believe there is more than one solution to this equation............................... By the way in the early 70's two guys raced a 426 hemi which apparently had 2000psi  sray bars fitted inside the inlet. Everyone said youre MAD, CRAZY, IT WONT WORK,while they kicked ass over many competitors and that was in the good ol' US of A...............................................GIBTG you seem to obviously believe you know it all. So far csiroc is way more a people person then you could ever hope to be.Stick that in your exhaust pipe.!If you are a guru ? I must be the next US president................................ A general note car magazines are continually trying to sell products from their advertisers,detracting from the real performance factor COST! Big HP Big$ components = Big$trans=Big$diff and wheels.To the average joe who does'nt know, articles should really asses All factors .Not just the glamour side of Big horsepower and burnouts. How about basic mods that really work for the dollars one spends.Power to weight education.Importance of gearing and performance even with a standard engine.Importance of brakes when increasing the power of the vehicle.All these factors should be considered, for budget and road safety purposes.  

I don't know everything but I do think that your idea is NOT going to work...

How all of a sudden does thinking outside of the box give you the ability to design a fuel injection system from next to nothing? Are you a engineer with the necessary equipment to actually build and test this thing? I get hostile when I feel like you're wasting the time of everyone here. When you're the only one left that thinks it will work don't continually try to push your "hypotheses" and trivial pursuit knowledge in an attempt to justify your own idea. You asked for advice on a public message board, it's my right to say my opinion, you have a problem with being told you're wrong, that's all. If you have this problem don't sit at your computer pumping out useless information go build the thing and get it over with, I don't think it will succeed but you don't listen to us anyway...  

GibTg, yada,yada,yada.You waste your own time.OK, so you think it wont work.God bless you. Really thats all you had to say.I pitty you and pray for those that have to endure your needless negativity. You may want to Carefully re-read my last entry.Evidently you did'nt which reflects your lack of understanding.Although your OUTSTANDING when it comes to derogatory criticism!This site would be better off without you,besides what gives you the right to assume what everyone thinks? theres only one GOD and you are'nt it.Thank GOD for that!  

I disagree, GibTG is a valuable asset.  I find his answers years old on google searches to questions I more recently have.  I have to agree with CSIROC and GibTG on this project, it may work well for an all out WOT engine but will do poorly at part throttle (like mechanical injection, but that at least had variable pump pressure to work with).  Even finding the right pulse width at peak power's rpm is going to be quite difficult if not impossible due to changing atmospheric conditions at different tracks or even through out the day.  Interesting project, but you're still arguing about re-inventing the wheel, more inefficiently at that.  

To answer some of your questions: Yes spark plug voltages are extremely high with extremely low amperage.  You provide any means for the spark plug current to go anywhere else (like an injector) than a plug then it will not fire the plug.  Any wire you tap into with less resistance than fuel charged air will suck the spark away. You would need a Hall Effect sensor (like a timing light trigger) for each plug wire plus another source of electricity and a microchip to convert the Hall Effect sensor signal into a relay signal to fire the injector.

Most fuel injectors are ran at 12V but it is important to know that they are triggered by the computer applying a ground signal to them, the Ohm ratings are to keep from frying the computer with too much amperage.  I don't know how a fuel injector will react to being triggered on the positive side.

Your custom injector idea will not work with out relays. Again, even though the spark plugs work on tens of thousands of volts the amperage is very small.  The voltage is generated by a magnetic field collapse and those are extremely low wattage in ignition systems.  It's just a simple way Tesla discovered to generate large voltages without a large amount of energy.  I'm not going to do the calculations but I know the wattage generated will not be of sufficient power to operate the fuel injector solenoid.

In short the spark plugs can not be any more than a reference with a Hall Effect sensor, and a computer of some sort will be needed to calculate fuel curves, unless you find a mechanical pump that increase pressure with rpm, and remember most multiport fuel injectors require minimum 40psi just to over come the spring pressure of the injector, so you will need a rpm variable pump that supplies high volume at high pressure.

*I replaced gauss meter with Hall Effect sensor, it seems more appropriate but are essentially the same thing.  

Thank you SIlVER BUICK! thanks for taking the time to read my hypo' and answering the question at hand.If someone had done that from the start it would have saved me alot of unnecessary typing.........................I will take your advice as you have more than satisfied my informational requirements regarding this particular matter......................Just out of curiosity, I think circa 84'GM made a similar idea. The distributor was empty other than the rotor button and cap and a couple of wires going to it.This was just prior to the advent of modern EFI.It was a crank triggered 6cyl ,they also had it on 4cyl as well.Did they have this in the states at the same time?in a medium sized GM car.Here it was called a vc commodore by GMH.  

I worked at a GM dealership several years ago for a few years, and have sold a bunch of General Autoparts for another few years and feel I have a pretty good handle on GM power trains up to around 2003 (the General is my Brand of choice) and that one is a new one to me.  I know they started using crank and cam triggered/referenced fuel injection in the late 80's, but the distributor to my knowledge has always been an ignition device.