Thanks Chopper it's really cool to recieve positive feedback.At first I was barraged with negativity from some people on this site,I guess they mean well but lack the courage,unlike yourself and some others.................Yeah computers are great,but when they fail,in extreme circumstances there is no quick fix............................Not one person has contemplated that a powerful magnetic field device or radio active device can throw a computer into chaos or even shut it down and it would'nt surprise me in the least,if such devices are in existance.....................................When Efi first emerged,my primary assumption was great idea and also bad idea.Computers are all related and I cannot help but feel that its part of a master plan.They are artificial and control way too much in our world.....................Just like cell phones, are they really spying devices and like a universal remote control,disguised as a phone?There is too much interlink,it bothers me...........Years ago like 60's "Dick tracy" had a talking video watch.Everyone laughed,now its a reality!..................One of the first injector set ups was essentially a mechanical pump and a nail with a hole through it,coarse,bad milage,however it worked. ....................There is alot to be said about a good mechanical device over the perils of an electronic equivalent............I've worked on a 1930's British capstan lathe.It was way ahead of its time.Built for weapons production (originally)it had a pnuematic,quick change chuck.I had a machine race vs a moriseki CNC,I beat it by 30% of its production output on the same component and it was made in the 1970'S.Sorry for rambling, but you know where I'm coming from ,thanks for the advice..............People are skeptical that our brains are radio wave receptors and can tune into frequencies. I've conducted my own surveys and discovered that too many people, admitting that the thought of a song comes into their head, they turn the radio on and voila' that songs playing,it's no co-incidence! and the secret oganisations Know it...............I believe in the mid to early 1900's an Italian scientist was able to stop all ac and dc powered devices in Sydney,Australia from Italy and everyone said nope and he achieved it for about 40 minutes,from the other side of the world..................What about the Lazers in the same time period,could cut down entire forrests in very quick time...............And lastly a yugoslav scientist who worked for an US electrical goods company,until they got to him, was able to extract lightening bolts from the sky!on days when there was zero thunder activity! and that was circa 1940's/50's. As a world we need to wake up,we should'nt take anything for granted.Sometimes I think the term "people are like sheep" is very true on a much bigger scale as so many are naive.  

Seems to me that if you believe all of that then you shouldn't even be using a computer, you are falling right into their "master plan".  And as far as your idea that when computers fail they are a hard fix, how easy would it be to fix your fuel control system?  If that is your argument for building this system then it is pretty flawed, seeing as it would still have alot of electric components that could fail as easy as a computer.  I don't know about your experiences, but I haven't found that it is a big problem with the computer messing up and causing a car not to run.  It usually is a mechanical part failure.  
Just my opinion.  

TheSilverBuick:
*The rotor never contacts the Distributor cap wire contacts, it requires the high voltage to arc from the rotor to the cap.

Might as well stop trying...its not being thought out well at all...and on top of that...who wants to re-invent the wheel?  Mechanical fuel injection has been around for a heck of a long time...and no one has thought to look at what those systems did...instead relying on rough ideas with no physical concept of whats really going on.  No matter how many flaws are found with this idea...its our "lack of imagination" thats preventing us from seeing the true genius of this idea...not our knowledge of how these things actually work...  

monte85:
Seems to me that if you believe all of that then you shouldn't even be using a computer, you are falling right into their "master plan".  And as far as your idea that when computers fail they are a hard fix, how easy would it be to fix your fuel control system?  If that is your argument for building this system then it is pretty flawed, seeing as it would still have alot of electric components that could fail as easy as a computer.  I don't know about your experiences, but I haven't found that it is a big problem with the computer messing up and causing a car not to run.  It usually is a mechanical part failure.  
Just my opinion.

Thats been my experience with my TPI...didn't have anything to do with the computer itself.  Had a lot to do with the fuel injectors (which he'll still need) and with the IAC valve's piston sticking in the bore (he'll have to figure out a choke mechanism anyway...and thats the basic function of this device).

Heck the number of vacuum lines required by this system alone will cause a headache when one develops a leak.

Oh...and thats not to mention that a carb will end up being a heck of a lot more accurate at metering fuel than this extremely rough idea.  

Conspiracy theories aside.......
I think that efi is the best way to fuel any piston engine.
Would I use it on my mower? No, ads too much weight & costs too much.
Would I use it on my boat? No way, I hate to row and salt kills everything.
Would I use it on a plane?........Meooooow SPLAT, anyway you get the picture.
As an electrician I eat because of reliability problems.
Thats why they have carbs! You have just got to admire the way a simple,well sized and tuned carb can run. So good in fact it makes mechanical injection a waste of time and money that could be better spent on making some real power.  

OK, so the rotor doesn't make contact with the terminals on the underside of the cap...modify it.  If one were so inclined, you could make the bottom of the cap work like brushes and slip rings on an electric motor.  Machine a non-conductive ring on the underside of the cap that is flush with the contacts, and attach a carbon-brush from a small motor to the tip of the rotor.  As the brush rides the ring and hits the contacts, conductivity is achieved, and the ground potential is sent to the injector.

Like I said...out of the box thinking.  It's just natural to some people.

*NOTE: I am personally a huge advocate of EFI.  It is the greatest thing since the advent of the vehicle. Period.  Heck, my '57 has TPI from an '86 IROC.  However, I'm merely suggesting a way for a mad scientist Car Crafter to achieve the results he imagined.  More power to him.  I hope he gets it running just to defy convention.  Why not?  

i have been disapointed.. in this thread..  there are so many great fuel injection systems out there.  and it seems like this thread is reinventing the stone..

some of the newest diesel fuel injectiors squeeze a piece of rock , then zap it with some electricity to make it viberate to control the injection pulses..


there are line pressures of over 20,000 psi and possably higher.. this allows direct fuel injection and super fine atmosazation..  even if i cannot spell it..


inventions are  invented to fill a need...

fuel injection predates carbs...  carbs were easier...

the newest devolipments in fuel injection are to meet emission standards to allow the automakers to continue to sell cars around the world.. horsepower makes people want to buy  them.

chrysler had electronic fuel injection in the late 50's..    but the (as the story goes) the vacuum tubes kept falling out of the sockets.  probably not ...

as for shielding for an emp..... that can be done now.. automakers don't do it for normal cars as it's not necessary.. it only costs more....

i think car makers took a hit much later from car production in the mid 60's and early 70's by making cars too durable...  the 70 f250 my mom drives everyday is 38 years old this model year... so far 2 clutch jobs a few brake jobs and 3 carb overhauls...

if they last too long they dont sell replacments...

end of rant for now......  

TheSilverBuick:
*The rotor never contacts the Distributor cap wire contacts, it requires the high voltage to arc from the rotor to the cap.

CSIROC:
Might as well stop trying...its not being thought out well at all...and on top of that...who wants to re-invent the wheel?  Mechanical fuel injection has been around for a heck of a long time...and no one has thought to look at what those systems did...instead relying on rough ideas with no physical concept of whats really going on.  No matter how many flaws are found with this idea...its our "lack of imagination" thats preventing us from seeing the true genius of this idea...not our knowledge of how these things actually work...

I know    

The controversy this thread has instigated! It appears that everyone who is against my idea dares to be different. On EFI, now that we have hybrid cars,if us rev heads really cared our world,these cars would be massively produced,but they are'nt.why?........Because there is still alot of petrolium being produced and oil companys who make Billions of $$$ dont want em yet!!!........There is a huge backorder for these water cars.I guess we'll be paying for water,what we now pay for fuel sometime in the future.................We'd also ban all forms of motorsport as they contribute hugely in percentage to pollution .But money talks and the people who run the world (globalisation) have financial and population control.They'll really be interested in pollution control when they have something to gain from it$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ until then I have to endure unsolicited comments and continuous derogatory innuendos ,stuff that I have never claimed. So GOD BLESS YOU ALL for being so indepthly unintuative. and so much for freedom?     My CONSPIRACY thread was a personal response to chopper kingpin,I assumed the GURU GM BRIGADE they know who they are,had well and truly finished their tirade against me.However ,its seems they still put in time and effort,which touches me deeply that you actually care so much.But I see lambs for the slaughter. Uh oh! I'm being different again,on this forum some consider it to be a felony!  

powerdreams check private messages for the answer to engine that run on water....if thats what you want...  it takes a differnt process...

did you see the guzer video where you take a pair of AA batterys and drop then into a glass of water let then sit a while.. take them out and you can light the water...

search guzer.co m for burning water...  

Wayne, I love horsepower.If I had my way.I would want the law in a world wide sense,to allow cars to go as fast as they safely can given the horsepower that they produce and an appropriate braking system,taking into account weight also.Along with safe and good condition tyres that can sustain high speeds....................this of course would be restricted to open roads only!.........On pollution and water cars I was being sarcastic to others comments regarding fuel efficiency and emissions,although my last entry is true and correct in terms of politics, anyone who is a REV or PETROL HEAD or CC really dont give one iota about emissions!....................Otherwise they would drive a water car .............I'll check out the guzer..................Another point was computers ha,ha! I'll use them against themselves!LMAO!..............meaning I have the right and freedom to publicly admit that I am skeptical about how far they do go,in terms of they can be used to do good,but in fact are a fools paradise,that includes me too............On fascinating topics check out 'scram jet',it goes something like 7 times the speed of sound and ignites the fuel by injecting it into a coduit of highly compressed air.In simple terms a fuel pump,an air compressor,injectors and an exhaust pipe in an aerodynamic craft that can take it.  

If you read thru this thread nobody said that your idea wouldn't work, people said that either they thought it wouldn't work or that if it did work it wouldn't work well.  You accuse everyone who disagrees with you as being closed minded, yet you don't listen to anyone elses opinion, even though that is what you were looking for when you posted your question.  And as far as what you say you don't really seem to know what you are talking about, in one post you stated that an O2 sensor was just for emissions, yet in another you stated you were going to use an O2 sensor to check the fuel ratio when you design your system. You also complained about getting unsolicited comments, this is a public forum, isn't the whole point to get comments.  Seems to me you are just trying to spread around your conspiracy ideas.  I read this board for the car information and the theory (the scientific theory not whatever you start spouting off) of why and how cars work.  Maybe if you read the comments you could get the info you asked for and maybe even be able to build your mechanical fuel injection.  

Firstly 'unsolicited comments' are directly aimed at derogatory and negative remarks,that have nothing to do with giving an opinion.So they are totally unecessary..........Secondly I know fully well,even before I posted the original thread that EFI is the optimal solution! So people arguing that point are telling me nothing thats newsbreaking..............Thirdly,without the o2 sensor,you would be hard pressed to control emissions as regulated by the government on EFI systems i.e the o2 relays info to the computer,if it senses too much emission it will back off the air/fuel mixture,whether the driver likes it or not........Car manufacturers test many cam profiles before they settle on one that can meet the desired power level and regulated emission standard.......If you take out the computer from the equation,the o2 sensor can strictly be used for tuning purposes and nothing else,the way I personally would like it to be.............And for your information I have read and appreciate all the constructive information I have recieved. I'm allowed to think and believe and know as I wish .If you want to live with the blind leading the blind thats your perogative. I choose to take the blinders off,you evidently don't.  

powerdreams:
Firstly 'unsolicited comments' are directly aimed at derogatory and negative remarks,that have nothing to do with giving an opinion.So they are totally unecessary..........Secondly I know fully well,even before I posted the original thread that EFI is the optimal solution! So people arguing that point are telling me nothing thats newsbreaking..............Thirdly,without the o2 sensor,you would be hard pressed to control emissions as regulated by the government on EFI systems i.e the o2 relays info to the computer,if it senses too much emission it will back off the air/fuel mixture,whether the driver likes it or not........Car manufacturers test many cam profiles before they settle on one that can meet the desired power level and regulated emission standard.......If you take out the computer from the equation,the o2 sensor can strictly be used for tuning purposes and nothing else,the way I personally would like it to be.............And for your information I have read and appreciate all the constructive information I have recieved. I'm allowed to think and believe and know as I wish .If you want to live with the blind leading the blind thats your perogative. I choose to take the blinders off,you evidently don't.

Once again you show a complete lack of knoweledge about the devices you plan to use.  The O2 sensor ONLY MEASURES the oxygen content in the exhaust.  It cannot in any way shape or form measure emissions.  An O2 sensor creates a voltage when a reaction takes place with OXYGEN.  ONLY OXYGEN.  It cannot in any way measure NOx...it cannot in any way measure the sulfur content in the exhaust...it cannot even measure the water vapor or nitrogen (N2) in the exhaust.  O2 sensors are STRICTLY used to keep the air fuel mixture at its OPTIMUM for a given load and RPM.  It will lean out the mixture under part throttle cruising to give you optimum gas mileage...it will richen the mixture for optimum power when you push your foot down...they correct for different weather or altitude conditions.  

THIS is why your system will never work...you have no understanding of how these components work.  

I gave up, figuring his blinders are off but he's still in a dark room.